30 Replies Latest reply on Aug 23, 2016 3:17 AM by saurabh2890

    microphones and the cirrus audio card

    soundcamp

      I want to use stereo electret condenser microphones with this card. They need a a bias voltage (Plug in Power) of around 5V.

       

      The Wolfson only included mono microphone support through the Mic in plug.

       

      The comparison table for the Cirrus says it supports stereo microphones through the Line in, and the video introduction to the card mentions that bias voltage is provided for electret condenser microphones, but doesn't give more detail.

       

      It would be great to have confirmation of what exactly this card provides in this direction.

       

      This is important because it decides if the card enables the Pi to be used as a high quality audio recorder without an additional soundcard - as the Wolfson sadly could not.

       

      Thanks

       

      Grant (soundCamp)

        • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
          shabaz

          Hi Grant,

           

          The circuit diagrams for the two cards (old and new) show the difference. You can see a 22k resistor on the L and R input channels connected to the WM5102 MICBIAS pins (described in the WM5102 datasheet). It is likely to be sufficient for any small electret element.

          The WM5102 datasheet contains more info, but according to it, the MICBIAS pins can be software enabled or disabled.

          • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
            timg73

            There is definitely a microphone bias circuit in the schematics, and even a script to enable recording from a biased microphone.  But I tried just now and couldn't actually measure any bias voltage.on the line-in connector.

              • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                soundcamp

                Ok Great - thanks Tim

                 

                so maybe it has to be enabled?

                 

                bw

                grant

                  • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                    timg73

                    Grant, if you take a look at the "scenario" scripts supplied in the Cirrus Logic disk image you'll see that Record_from_lineIn_Micbias.sh includes a line to "Enable MICBIAS".  Though for me it doesn't seem to work.

                      • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                        soundcamp

                        Thanks, Tim

                         

                        I'll download and have a look.

                         

                        I was waiting to buy the card until finding out if this functionality exists - it sounds from this as though it does and presumably just needs some tweaking. It sounds like the hardware setup visibly supports PiP via the Line In. So I'll get a card and test.

                         

                        If anybody is still working with audio streaming with the Wolfson, we have a disk image available from  here, currently being used for a nice live audio stream from Seoul here. This image was very much dependent on support from Ragnar Jensen.

                         

                        I can't say I particularly look forward to trying to make a new image with Darkice and the Cirrus drivers.. well but with this new capability it should be well worth it

                         

                        bw

                        grant

                          • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                            scotth

                            Great thread, all information is very useful.

                             

                            Some additional points

                            • The Cirrus card has been updated to include stereo MICBIAS on the Line Input.
                            • The script setup file in the image will configure the ability for microphone recording
                            • After executing the setup script, the MICBIAS voltage will only be enabled when an active record is configured, i.e. arecord. This is part of the software power management.
                            • The MICBIAS voltage is typically 2.7V.
                              • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                soundcamp

                                Thanks, Scott

                                 

                                That's very useful and clarifies the query about enabling the bias voltage.

                                 

                                2.7V is not as high as we'd like for the electret microphones we're using, but we will see how it goes.

                                 

                                I ordered a couple of soundcards yesterday and we'll run some tests and post updates, and no doubt questions, here

                                 

                                bw

                                grant

                                  • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                    soundcamp

                                    Electret condenser microphones via the Cirrus Logic Line In - updated

                                     

                                    Hi Scott and all

                                     

                                    We successfully installed Darkice over the new Cirrus image and all works well. Much easier than previously with the Wolfson.

                                     

                                    We ran the use script to record from the Line in with Mic Bias as suggested above, and plugged in a pair of omni stereo microphones of decent quality.

                                     

                                    We are now streaming what appears to be very good, detailed audio with a good tone and nice spatial sense - very promising.

                                     

                                    However, we have a loud hum which sounds like an earthing type issue.

                                     

                                    It looks like there is a hi-pass filter in the script:

                                     

                                    # Configure the input path for 0dB Gain,  HPF with a low cut off for DC removal

                                    amixer $1 -Dhw:sndrpiwsp cset name='LHPF1 Mode' High-pass

                                    amixer $1 -Dhw:sndrpiwsp cset name='LHPF2 Mode' High-pass

                                     

                                    But the loud hum remains and filtering it would severely impact on the audio.

                                     

                                    Any thoughts on how to address this would be great

                                     

                                    Thanks

                                     

                                    Best wishes

                                    Grant

                                      • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                        soundcamp

                                        Hi all

                                        Further to my post on hum using ECM microphones with the Cirrus Line In, we've found that the hum is not present on all microphones.

                                        So this probably  shouldn't  be considered a serious problem.

                                        We'll test the Primo EM-172 and report on how those work.

                                        bw

                                        grant

                                        • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                          binauralhead

                                          I would be very happy if you could let me know how you managed to do this.

                                          I've purchased the card, and for the life of me can't get it to work with Darkice/Icecast2.

                                           

                                          Wanted to use Darkice and Icecast2 for streaming live binaural audio to a on-line radio web server (working on my other Raspberry Pi and Behringer UCA202)

                                          Just that the Behringer is a tad noisy, hoping the Cirrus card is much less noise floor.

                                           

                                          Wanting to stream MP3 live audio from the cirrus card through to a 3G mobile network here in the UK.

                                           

                                          Regards

                                            • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                              soundcamp

                                              Hi Alan

                                               

                                              We found it's a little tricky compiling Darkice over the Cirrus Logic image. We will make a disk image available over the next couple of days and let you know

                                               

                                              bw

                                              grant

                                                • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                  binauralhead

                                                  Thanks for letting me know that you are on the case Grant.

                                                  Looking forward in hearing from you.

                                                   

                                                  Regards

                                                  Alan

                                                    • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                      soundcamp

                                                      Hi Alan and all

                                                       

                                                      We have a disk image that streams stereo audio using Darkice and the Cirrus Logic Card with Pi B+ or A+. It uses the Line In with bias voltage by dafault, and has been working well with electret condenser microphones.

                                                       

                                                      It is available to download with notes from the soundCamp resources page here (where there are also images for the Wolfson and other setups)

                                                       

                                                      Best wishes

                                                      Grant (soundCamp)

                                                        • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                          binauralhead

                                                          Great stuff Grant, one problem!

                                                          I need another 734PB of disk space to extract.. tried downloading twice, must be corrupt, same result.

                                                           

                                                          Will try later this evening.

                                                          Regards

                                                          Alan

                                                          734PB.png

                                                            • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                              soundcamp

                                                              Hi Alan

                                                              Thanks for picking that up.

                                                              I'll check it out and see what's going on

                                                               

                                                              bw

                                                              grant

                                                                • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                                  soundcamp

                                                                  Hi Alan and all

                                                                   

                                                                  We have uploaded a verified new disk image to  the soundCamp resources page

                                                                   

                                                                  soundCamp resources - Pi SD Card - Download

                                                                   

                                                                  I hope that will work fine now

                                                                   

                                                                  Let me know if you have any other issues

                                                                   

                                                                  bw

                                                                  grant

                                                                    • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                                      binauralhead

                                                                      Hi Grant,

                                                                       

                                                                      Thank you for your hard work, and to the others who are working on this cirrus logic audio card too.

                                                                       

                                                                      I've tried the new image, it works, I've managed to stream on the test stream, there's a little interference coming through a "buzzz" which changes as you move the card and wires about, you can get it so that it is almost gone too.

                                                                       

                                                                      Not sure if it has to get to the GUI? Would have liked headless, I've tried turning off the GUI but it's got some script running for the IP which stalls the command line. Changing the host name breaks some things too.

                                                                       

                                                                      I'm confused as how darkice works without Icecast2.

                                                                       

                                                                      My new account for the testing microphone site breaks the streaming as well, not sure why, there is a conflict of terms in the conf file to the information given after new account conformations.. being a fair newbie probably isn't helping me comprehend what is going on in that config file.

                                                                       

                                                                      Was hoping to run SAMBA, WEB Server, noip ddns client, sakis3g, Icecast2 and stream to another online server, though I am quite interested with the microphone radio site, as it works on "switch on", so why not use this without me faffing about trying to get other things to work when not needed? probably the challenge! but an easy excuse not to try.

                                                                       

                                                                      I hope to have some answers from the help guys on the microphone site, so with luck will have "Liverpool_3D_binaural" sound stream up and running soon.

                                                                       

                                                                      I am so grateful for those who have worked hard to get things going, thank you very much guys!

                                                                       

                                                                      Regards

                                                                      Alan

                                                                        • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                                          soundcamp

                                                                          Hi Alan and all

                                                                          I'm glad the disk image has been useful to get started. I will check how to disable the automatic darkice script to make it easier to work with.

                                                                           

                                                                          I'm sorry that realistically I won't be able to provide much detailed advice and support on applying the card to other uses - although I am happy if it is contributes to those.

                                                                           

                                                                          I should also be clear about some limits to its use:

                                                                           

                                                                          This disk image is designed specifically as an approach for live audio streaming to the Locus Sonus open microphone soundmap.

                                                                          The notes etc on the soundCamp resources page are also aimed at that.

                                                                          The soundmap itself is a specific project, with specific parameters, described here http://locusonus.org/ -Locustream

                                                                          It's a long standing project (not mine), and isn't intended to include eg conventional radio material, recordings, musical performance, etc


                                                                          So if people are experimenting with the disk image, beyond preliminary testing, you should alter the stream configuration file to point at your own icecast server (which you could also set up on a local machine).


                                                                          Please use the disk image for your own projects as useful.


                                                                          But please don't use the Locus Sonus server for general experimentation.

                                                                           

                                                                          I should have been clearer about that when I shared the link.

                                                                           

                                                                          Thanks

                                                                          Best wishes

                                                                          Grant

                                                                            • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                                              binauralhead

                                                                              Hello Grant, et al..

                                                                               

                                                                              The thought of "this could get interesting" came to mind when I realised that with a fresh image, network connection and power on, you would be streaming, if it were to be popular to download ...... When I realised this, I was very conscious of being switched on, and on-line - hence my swift move.

                                                                               

                                                                              "The soundmap itself is a specific project, with specific parameters, described here http://locusonus.org/ -Locustream

                                                                              It's a long standing project (not mine), and isn't intended to include eg conventional radio material, recordings, musical performance, etc"


                                                                              This sounds like the perfect place for my binaural microphones!! This is very much NOT a conventional way to record things or to have streaming live, and is something I have been looking for many months. If anyone cares to have a listen to any of my binaural recordings, and see what "Frank the terrorist" has been upto please wear your best headphones and click here: https://soundcloud.com/binauralhead you can also see what I have been up to on the blog, address is on the soundcloud channel, if you read the full profile on "Frank".


                                                                              Having the raspberry Pi in a bag (or anywhere), with battery and 3G/4G dongle and a "binaural microphone" .. would, for me, be quite something, esp if there was a dedicated website that had many binaural microphones placed about the globe, to experience being there would be totally awesome. Unless you have experienced listening with headphones what binaural audio is, you will have no idea what I am on about.


                                                                              If it were not for people like Grant, and the people who are doing the microphone project, I would not be so excited with this idea, and it would probably never have happened for me. In the last 12 months of being interested with binaural audio I have met, quite by chance, some very famous people, and been to famous film studios with both my dummy head microphones - all were totally awesome experiences!!


                                                                              Being able to listen to an audio stream that has very good quality, live (or recorded) from your iPhone, MAC or PC, Library or on-line radio station is just as good, if not better than 3D vision! and if combined...


                                                                              I feel that something very good could come of this, and if not, it's something that keeps me interested with sound, the raspberry pi, and new people to talk with, who could want for anything more?


                                                                              Slice of Pi anyone?


                                                                              Regards

                                                                              Alan


                                                                    • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                                      georgpi

                                                                      These big images are a waste of time in my opinion. The only thing you need is a kernel (with realtime capabilities) Here is 3.12.33 for the os of YOUR choice.

                                                                      https://blog.georgmill.de/2015/02/18/update-for-wolfson-audio-card-on-raspberry-pi/

                                                                       

                                                                      Have fun :-)

                                                • Re: microphones and the cirrus audio card
                                                  saurabh2890

                                                  hi every one,,,I am using a TEA5767 tuner to feed the output in to cirrus audio logic card from LINE IN ...the input sound is recorded and able to make a file .........................I want to listen live audio input  which is going in to  LINE in    from other port.....the other port may be LINE OUT..... is it possible,,,,,please help,,,,,,,,