16 Replies Latest reply on Apr 14, 2020 1:59 PM by weiwei2

    Rude awakening

    rsc

      I received this today:

      So now I have to choose to continue this project and pay Microsoft, or quit and work on something else.

      Here's my "Free Trial" cost analysis:

      So....if I choose to continue to work on this project for another month, it will cost me approx $150 without changing any features.

      I'm not sure its worth the price just to enter a contest.

      Scott

        • Re: Rude awakening
          javagoza

          Approximately $ 6 per day and a single device? That is not scalable.

          What kind of data and how often are you monitoring it?

          3 of 3 people found this helpful
            • Re: Rude awakening
              rsc

              If you want to save data and plot the data a "Time Series Insights environment" attached to your IoT Hub is $150 /month using default options.

              If you click on pay-as-you-go, you get different pricing.  I didn't see any option where storage and data plotting was "free".

              When I signed up, it said I had a $200 start up credit to use.  Maybe if I delete the time series option I can continue.

              3 of 3 people found this helpful
            • Re: Rude awakening
              kmikemoo

              I have received something similar.  Let me lead with "Go slow.  It doesn't have to cost you anything."

              When I signed up for my "free" account, I used my hotmail.com account - because it's a Microsoft account.  Well... I got the "You're Number 1!" sign, but they used the wrong finger.  By then, Microsoft already had my credit card so when I tried my work email I got directed to a pay-as-you-go account.  Basically, every way I turned, I was told "You're Number 1!"

              So I relented and used a different credit card and went with a pay-as-you-go plan.

              When you set up your IoT Hub, you don't have to take the "pay" option.  You can change the settings to the free version.  This version limits the amount of data that you can poll, but it's still not a debilitating amount.

              What I can confirm is that for the month that I have had the account, I have been billed ZERO dollars.

              4 of 4 people found this helpful
              • Re: Rude awakening
                clem57

                rsc  wrote:

                 

                I received this today:

                So now I have to choose to continue this project and pay Microsoft, or quit and work on something else.

                Here's my "Free Trial" cost analysis:

                So....if I choose to continue to work on this project for another month, it will cost me approx $150 without changing any features.

                I'm not sure its worth the price just to enter a contest.

                Scott

                Oh no. Same here

                3 of 3 people found this helpful
                • Re: Rude awakening
                  Fred27

                  It easy to accidentally configure something that costs more than you thought. I recently did the same but fortunately it was just a day before my free £40/month (via MSDN) rolled over. I find the best way is to work out what was doing it, wait until your account rolls over and delete it. It's amazing what you do get for free, but also surprising what can cost a fixed monthly fee.

                   

                  At least Microsoft don't suddenly land you with hundreds in fees without warning. (I'm talking about you, Pluralsight!)

                  3 of 3 people found this helpful
                  • Re: Rude awakening
                    colporteur

                    Now that the issue preventing my Reply Why no Reply link on this post has returned, I can ask my question.

                     

                    What service(s) are you paying for that are required to support the Azure? What is the threshold for the service to cost more than free?

                     

                    I don't recall reading the requirements that indicates a cost. This seems like a shady up sell opportunity. "Hey you can have this development system for free. As your development progresses and you are ready to delivering milestones, we will charge you. "

                     

                    I have a strong negative bias to the products offered by the MS blackhole. These kinda gotchas just seems to be the hair on their blackhole.

                     

                     

                    Sean

                    • Re: Rude awakening
                      Fred27

                      Dial back the anti Microsoft conspiracy. It's not a deliberate trap. Nobody has been charged a cent. It's just that some helpful guides try to illustrate the simplest way to do things without thinking about the fact that some people are on limited subscriptions. When you try something out just take a look at the cost prediction. Some things are charged by use. Some have a regular fee. Delete stuff if you've tested something but no longer need it.

                      1 of 1 people found this helpful
                        • Re: Rude awakening
                          rsc

                           

                           

                          Dial back the anti Microsoft conspiracy. It's not a deliberate trap. Nobody has been charged a cent. It's just that some helpful guides try to illustrate the simplest way to do things without thinking about the fact that some people are on limited subscriptions. When you try something out just take a look at the cost prediction. Some things are charged by use. Some have a regular fee. Delete stuff if you've tested something but no longer need it.

                          " Nobody has been charged a cent." ==> Do you work for Microsoft? How do you know this?  If there are no charges, then why do they have to have my credit card number?

                          Interesting business model.

                            • Re: Rude awakening
                              Fred27

                              I meant that as standard the service stops rather than continuing and billing you. (Not like Pluralsight, who recently billed me $299 to renew a one-off purchase that I hadn't used for 7 months. They have a strict "no refunds" policy too.)

                               

                              Sorry - the conspiracy bit does sound a bit harsh and wasn't really aimed at you!

                              1 of 1 people found this helpful
                                • Re: Rude awakening
                                  colporteur

                                  I seem to recall you indicated the water was fine and participants should all continue to jump in, the last time a less than stellar post on the Azure initiative caused someones teeth to chatter.

                                   

                                  Care to indicate who the conspiracy theorist label was intended for?

                                   

                                   

                                  Sean

                            • Re: Rude awakening
                              ducktail

                              My credit card was charged when I registered, according to Microsoft it would be reverse at the end of the month. Will monitor that to ensure the reversal is done.

                               

                              After playing with the board I realized that the  free subscription will be used up really fast  if we are not careful. If this were to go into production you will have a few hundreds or worst  a few thousands of these boards deployed as one of my customer pointed out.

                               

                              So my testing would Really determine whether it's feasible to go with this board or some other SBC/microcontroller that doesn't use Microsoft Products( restricted for now).  And implement some other security like WoTT.

                               

                              Just my personal observations  after testing..........

                              1 of 1 people found this helpful
                                • Re: Rude awakening
                                  colporteur

                                  Your observations provide insight into an incremental costs that would come into play post development for a production solution. The total cost of ownership (TCO) for such a solution would need to include the data overhead costs.

                                   

                                  Is the Azure solution restricted to just the MS portal or does the technology permit other opportunities? I ask because I don't have any insight. I elected to not participate in the offering. In the end Canada was not supported in the trial.

                                   

                                  I make it a point to closely examine TCO for a solution I have found sometimes the sticker price for implementation is attractive but the ongoing costs can be crippling. Especially when the pricing is per unit deployment.

                                   

                                  I recall implementing a vendor solution that included 25K licenses. No one asked about the costs posts 25K. After being in production for two years the initial license block was consumed and the size of addition license blocks was smaller with the costs incrementally higher. What could you do when you are locked into the solution!

                                   

                                  Something designers should be aware of. IoT solutions for ten development units verses 10K production units can exhaust a budget real fast.

                                   

                                  Sean

                                  2 of 2 people found this helpful
                                    • Re: Rude awakening
                                      shabaz

                                      Hi Sean,

                                       

                                      All the cloud providers have billing that sometimes takes a while to get the head around, not because they're intentionally trying to get the casual user testing their system to pay huge fees, but just simply because the casual user is using the exact same system as the people building large services.

                                       

                                      They don't mostly mind the casual user with their few hundred requests a month, because they want them to build up to hundreds of thousands of requests a month. My monthly AWS bill is tiny, I only use it to test a few features from time to time.

                                       

                                      Once with AWS as an individual I had a huge bill ($200 for a month), but it was my fault - I was using IaaS (i.e. dedicating resources for myself), and I powered up a massive machine, and forgot to turn it off : ( In that respect, the IoT solutions from Amazon, Microsoft etc can be cheaper for the causal experimenter or design engineer, since it is PaaS which is not dedicating (much) computing resources until they are needed. Taken to the extreme, there's the possibility of consuming zero computing power until customers come along, using so-called FaaS (function-as-a-service). With that, provided you're not using other billable things to design the solution (e.g. large databases) then there is zero cost (or near-zero, since it depends on how the service provider wants to handle it) and you only incur cost that grows as usage of the service grows. AWS offer that, Azure will have a similar thing.

                                       

                                      Using typical third party software IP in code can (sometimes) initially cost heaps more than an IoT solution from the SPs, depending on how specialist or desirable it is. They like older licensing schemes, e.g. a block of licenses, so there is a larger up-front cost.

                                       

                                      The IoT solutions are more granular, at least the ones I've encountered, to encourage developers to test them out with zero or near-zero cost, and then ramp up.

                                      6 of 6 people found this helpful
                                        • Re: Rude awakening
                                          colporteur

                                          I have limited experience developing systems outside a closed environment. Closed in the sense the systems were within a network the company owned and managed. As an ISP provider the network was large and 100K of devices. Not big to US standards but large in Canada.

                                           

                                          In the true sense of IoT, the client (i.e. IoT device) could be in any network. Finding an IoT data collector that has a reach into the expanse of any everywhere network would be daunting. I can only imagine the claims of vendors to garner business. Proving the claims would be a task.

                                           

                                          Providers of the service and costing models piques my interest. I have to confess, I can have an interest knowing the details but am relieved I won't be part of a team trying to deliver.

                                           

                                          Sean

                                          2 of 2 people found this helpful
                                    • Re: Rude awakening
                                      weiwei2

                                      i am just curious if using azure sphere with Azure is still gonna have free option ?